Mangascreener and Manga Daisuki : The truth.

Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2002 3:15 pm

The truth is: Manga Daisuki does distro for a branch off group named Null, which is composed completely of MD members. This branch of group released around 10 chapters of manga, with what it said were its own translations. However upon comparison, they are in fact Stephen Paul's (the head translator for Mangascreener) who has continued translating One Piece for those people who either have the Japanese version or cannot get the upcoming english version. One thing he said quite clearly on his page http://stephen.swoo.net is that the translations were not to be used for manga scanlation. But some people obviously can't read.
So time passes, stephen leaves notes in the MD forums telling them they're stealing translations, but no one listens... So i come into the picture, i meen, my good friend and loyal translator has been wronged in the worst possible crime a manga group can commit.
So i post a rather angry topic on the MS page, saying that MD needs to take responsibility and fix this (something i think is well within the lines of what should happen.) But instead i get a backdraft of spite from them, that is of course until i talk to [Infornography], a person whom i have gained a certain level of respect for. We hammered out the problems during an hour of chat between 10 and 11pm PST last night. I went to bed at 11:20 feeling as if this was all settled, and i would be able to wake up and see that things had changed, in fact, here's the large part of the conversation i had with Info last night:

<[Infornography]> Izumi, I'm from #MD
<[Infornography]> I would like to talk to you concerning OP
<Izumi> whatcha need
<Izumi> unless you're here to apologize, don't waste my time
<[Infornography]> Hello.
<Izumi> yo
<[Infornography]> If kicking and banning not to mention firing the lead
editor of [Null] is considered an apology then, by all means.
<[Infornography]> We don't edit or translate OP. We merely distro it. [Null]
translates and edits it
<[Infornography]> I'm trying to get it off our distro line as well
<[Infornography]> i fired the lead editor who i hold responsible for
stealing the trans.
<Izumi> null doesn't translate
<Izumi> thats the issue here
<[Infornography]> we realize that.
<[Infornography]> From what ami-chan told me
<[Infornography]> and from what you said, is that the translations were
stolen
<Izumi> well i don't want an apology for me, i want an apology for stephen
paul
<[Infornography]> without permission
<Izumi> who is probably not going to translate any more OP because of this
<[Infornography]> #MD cannot personally take responsibility for this. [Null]
has no editing or translating conenctions with us. we merely distro.
<[Infornography]> #MD's founder didn't even approve OP it was a minor staff
<[Infornography]> Were going to do something about OP though.
<[Infornography]> Starmatrix, the person i'm holding responsible is a
difficult person.
<[Infornography]> I don't think he will apologize.
<[Infornography]> But, if it's any consolation, We have shitlisted him from
our chan
<Izumi>
http://www.gamenet.nu/md/forum/showthread.php3?s=58922c4b9c5ceea4494c85dcb1f
bb63a&threadid=508&pagenumber=2
<[Infornography]> and cut off any connections with him.
<Izumi> i suggest you check this out
<Izumi> this was 5 days ago
<Izumi> more than enough time for someone from your page to read it
<Izumi> its on YOUR forum
<Izumi> and by the translator himself
<Izumi> -_-
<[Infornography]> i realize that.
<[Infornography]> I'll read it.
<Izumi> if someone sells a store stolen property, and the store turns around
and sells it only to be caught
<Izumi> who gets busted by the police?
<Izumi> well if the police are good, the person who stole it will get
caught, but more often than not its the fault of the store itself
<[Infornography]> yes. I understand.
<Izumi> and believe it or not, plenty of people goto jail for selling stolen
property
<Izumi> some of which they didn't even know was stolen
<[Infornography]> But, are you "good police" or "bad police"?
<Izumi> right now, i'm sticking up for my translator
<Izumi> who did the best he could to get this solved under the table
<[Infornography]> I understand your feelings we would do the same.
<Izumi> he put up notices on his page, your forum, and e-mailed plenty of
people
<Izumi> even wrote on the shonen jump mailing list about it
<[Infornography]> We don't want anything to do with stolen translations
<[Infornography]> I'm going to try and get OP out of our line
<[Infornography]> #MD can't do an apology because we didn't steal the trans.
The editor of OP did. Or More appropriatly [Null]
<Izumi> at least apologize on your page for providing a venue for distor
<[Infornography]> But , as a staff member of #MD I apologize for what has
happened. And I apologize for not becoming aware of the siatation sooner
<Izumi> thats all you have to do to clear your name on this ok
<[Infornography]> Unfortunately, our page is down.
<Izumi> well then put something in the forum
<[Infornography]> But all i can do it change the topic on the chan
<Izumi> at least give this some closure
<[Infornography]> yes. I will do everything possible.
<Izumi> =)
<Izumi> thank you
<[Infornography]> Tell Stephen, that although #MD can't personally take
responsibility or apologize for the translations. I apologize for this.
<[Infornography]> and that if anything of a similar nature happens, to
contact me first
<[Infornography]> and i'll see to it that this gets taken care of
<Izumi> thank you for this
<Izumi> i'm just sticking up for my head translator
<Izumi> who works selflessly translating more than a volume of manga a week,
every week, for years
<Izumi> -_-
<[Infornography]> I understand your sentiment
<[Infornography]> seriously
<[Infornography]> good translators are hard to find today
<[Infornography]> especially jap ones
<Izumi> even after one piece got cancelled, he kept on translating for those
people who owned the books, but now i think he'll probably quit that
<[Infornography]> i hope that doesn't happen.
<Izumi> i hope so too
<[Infornography]> can you do us a favor?
<Izumi> stephen is honestly one of the best hearted hardest working
translators on the net
<Izumi> and it hurts to see him stepped on like this
<Izumi> sure
<[Infornography]> can you at least change your page so that instead of
blaming #MD blame [Null]
<[Infornography]> I know seriously. Most translators quit after awhile
<[Infornography]> or are never serious about the project to begin with
<Izumi> i did append it
<Izumi> but i obviously need to change the append
<[Infornography]> for minto, we had to translate it sometimes ourselves, and
once we even had to borrow a translator from mangasync
<[Infornography]> I'll work on posting something on the forums
<[Infornography]> Izumi: Null is looking into finding a translator for it.
<[Infornography]> If they find a translator and continue would you have any
qualms with it?
<Izumi> heck no
<Izumi> originally they asked in the channel if it was ok, and i said sure,
just don't use stephen's tarnslations
<Izumi> but they need to re-do all the chapters they have using someone else
<[Infornography]> lol
<[Infornography]> i might have to quit #MD soon
<[Infornography]> i've overstepped alot of boundries today. Especially with
firing Starmatrix.

You can probably see why i respect Info, he's level headed and was willing to work with me to solve this problem.
I put some appends to the topic i made last night, and hoped to wake up the next morning refreshed and without this frustration in my life, and this is what Ichitaka the founder of MD wrote on their webpage:

_______________________________________
Who cares with this bastard keep blaming that we are the one who should responsible for anything that have something to do with MD... Ok, we MD officially said that null is one of our group, and we still gonna use the translaitons, ever since we don't like the way how MangaScreener acted toward us. Just keep blaming us as one of the culprit, hell no, and we have to appologize, take your own words... We are going to keep this thing going till MangaScreener take down all the bad news about us, and not blaming us on the releases...

Also we never have a fight with our staff about this, even with null's staff... it's just personal reason from one of our op, so MangaScreener, you better learn to watch your word, before you start talking nonesense in your website and topic. We are all tired with your word, there is no truth behind that, just talking crap without knowing the truth, hahaaaa.... just childish person will do that...

For all the fans, if you want to go for MangaScreener, go on, we don't care about all this bigmouth who don't have any attitude toward us as one of the Manga group on the net. We won't explain anything about null and OP project, till MangaScreener take down all the content related to us, in the website or even in the channel. Also if they don't release anything... Oh yeah, they are the one who should apologize to us... (right!!???)
_____________________________________________________

I think something is truely screwed up here, what do you guys think?

Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2002 3:33 pm

Quote:

I think something is truely screwed up here, what do you guys think?

yesh i think it's pretty messed up...-_-;;

(yesh....Infornography ish a great person. he stayed for hours in #ms just so that there would finally be peace between MD and MS...-_-)

Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2002 3:37 pm

I think [Infornography] has a future in US politics .... I could easily see through the smoke and mirrors .....

Does MD really want to start a war between Manga groups on the internet? because that post on their website would start a war if we were rival countries ...

Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2002 3:40 pm

Quote:

Does MD really want to start a war between Manga groups on the internet? because that post on their website would start a war if we were rival countries ...

*sighs* yea...it doesn't seem like Ichitaka wants to so easily let go of this...>.> it seems like he does want a war...-_-

Guest

Umm well i dunno but wouldn't the best thing be to ask steph to stop transelating OP?
i mean there is no way that u can get rid of the manga already out there.
i dun think there is much else anyone can do.
going deeper into this may start up something really bad >.<

Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2002 3:47 pm

<Izumi> we need to talk
<[Infornography]> i'm here
<Izumi> i thought this was all over with last night
<Izumi> can't you at least keep ichitaka from starting this thing over again
<Izumi> -_-
<[Infornography]> gomen, but your website is still fueling controversy
<[Infornography]> i told you that we can't apologize since it wasn't our project
<[Infornography]> but your website still states that you demand it
<[Infornography]> i went to #mangascreener to tell you that today, but you weren't there
<Izumi> my additional additional says that i accepted your apology as of 11pm last night
<Izumi> -_-
<[Infornography]> let me look at it
<[Infornography]> i see
<[Infornography]> the problem with that is
<[Infornography]> you took it wrong last night
<[Infornography]> I said that i banned starmatrix because i had an argument with him. He was the editor of OP. And I said that " If you wanted to take that as an apology then there it is "
<Izumi> <[Infornography]> If kicking and banning not to mention firing the lead
<Izumi> editor of [Null] is considered an apology then, by all means.
<Izumi> your own words
<Izumi> =P
<[Infornography]> yes.
<Izumi> thats just what i put in my news
<[Infornography]> I said that you can take it as that.
<[Infornography]> but i never said that it was an apology itself by #MD
<[Infornography]> I also repeated after that statement that #MD cannot apologize for OP or it's translations because we were not aware of it
<[Infornography]> being stolen
<[Infornography]> and the sole responsibility of it is [Null] a group whose trans and edits are not affiliated with #MD
<Izumi> you should at least apogize for not knowint it was stolen
<Izumi> it was your channel that distroed them
<[Infornography]> 'm sorry but #MD cannot apologize for something that we were not aware of. And since #MD 's founder was never aware of this ,then #MD can by any means apologize.
<[Infornography]> the only thing i'm glad is at least me and you can try to resolve this peacefully.
<[Infornography]> without tearing our heads off.
<Izumi> well how can we reach a compromise
<[Infornography]> Our earlier conversation seemed to have worstened the situation.
<Izumi> can you promise me that you won't allow any more OP using stephen's translation to be produced or DISTRIBUTEd in your channel
<Izumi> i didn't think so
<[Infornography]> I'm not in the position to promise that.
<Izumi> i went to sleep thinking it was over
<Izumi> find out if you can make that promise
<[Infornography]> I went to sleep thinking it was over as well.
<Izumi> talk to ichitaka
<[Infornography]> I can't make that promise
<Izumi> tell him he can do whatever the heck he wants with OP, just without stephen's translations
<[Infornography]> you'd have to talk to Ichitaka personally
<Izumi> and if he agrees to that, then i'll take down any inflamitory remarks
<[Infornography]> I'll give him your message, but please talk to him personally.
<Izumi> this isn't a business where we need lawyers around, just make me a promise and go through with it
<Izumi> we're talking about osmething thats very reasonable
<Izumi> you keep doing OP, but find your own translator
<Izumi> thats all i want
<[Infornography]> I'll tell him everything you just said.
<[Infornography]> But please, so as to not make any misunderstanding, talk to him personally.

Guest

he's right izumi u should go talk to the guy, even if u may not like to.
asking someone else to dilivier a message can often lead to grave misunderstandings.

Guest

Our conversation last night seemed to only calm things down for a bit. Again, i would like to state that i kicked and banned Starmatrix from #MD. That's true. But it was out of personal problems. DarkBahamut , Maestro2k and others can validate this. It was of coincidence that he was the editor for OP. I did not want to start a war. Nor do I wish to continue one. If nothing else, Izumi, please talk to Ichitaka, not just for the sake of your translator, but for both loyal fans of #MD and #MS. Please try and resolve things peacefully. Also, i take responsibility for last nights misunderstanding and I alone, take responsibility for the current escalation of hostilities between our 2 manga chans. I have no authority to promise anything. I , like everyone else, hope that the situation gets resolved peacefully.

Fan Boy Joined: 20 Oct 2002 Posts: 1

Greetings,

I just recently became aware of this whole situation and thought perhaps I should share my stance on all this. From the start Null was never intended to be a group, it was more of a personal project, to continue Naruto from where TW had left off.

From there it sort of carried on, people supplying either scripts/raws or helping out whenever they became available. There was no organization to it, and as far as I know, there is still none.

My point is, null as I know it, is a bunch of individuals doing their own thing. Heck.. anyone here could go do their own chapter of something and call it a Null release. No one would stop/question you. So go easy on the flames on MD. They have little to no control over what goes on... and unless the editors are informed directly or read the forums, they won't have any idea either.

In my case, my primary project is Naruto. But I have edited a couple chapters of OP and released it when the raws/scripts were offered, and for that I apologize to all parties concerned. I wasn't aware of the conditions attached to the scripts, but I should have checked.

I hope this clears the air a little, it would be a shame to see two groups go through such unpleasantness over a matter like this.

Ryoga

Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2002 5:00 pm

so where does the blaim lay, who supplied you with scripts?

Fan Boy Joined: 11 Oct 2002 Posts: 2 Location: melbourne

I don't wanna give gasoline to this thing since I'm a fan for all scanlator group ou tthere.... you did great job and all. you have the same purpose/goal which is to satisfy our lust of manga voluntarily.... but when a person said that a group can't use something and pls do so...

and also to izumi... human always try to find something to blame but wouldn't it be great to find someone who doesn't blame anything and take those blame on him/herself?
and yes I wanna know also who provide the translation... I love [NULL]'s works especially naruto but to see them stop becos of this is crazy.....

well that's my thought anyway... pls don't get angry becos of this....

PS: sorry if I misspelled anything since my english isn't good Sad

Guest

this may seem very heated, but the 'war' between #MS and #MD is just going to be a small skirmish that is going to be ended in a few days. I just cannot see a lasting hateship develop here... someone is going to take the blame and it will all end. a compromise will probably be met soon..

Guest

just thought of something after reading some stuff at MD forums. Why don't you just get the [NULL] guy to apologize? or why doesn't MD get [NULL] to apologize? wouldn't that appease everyone?

Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2002 6:51 pm

at this point, it's clear that it's some anonymous individuals who used the scripts by handing them off to other, unknowing people who simply took them at face value. at the moment, i'm too tired of this deal to worry about apologies from [null], because something tells me whoever did it doesn't give a damn about this. all i want is for them not to use my scripts. that's all.

i don't really care about apologies or the "honor" of our two groups and i hope people put this behind them and forget about it. i'll be happy if nobody uses my one piece scripts for scanlations.

swoo seems to be down right now, but the next time i can upload i'm going to change the one piece page a bit *wink*

Street Musician Joined: 13 Oct 2002 Posts: 419

Okay, so just stop distribution of the OP manga. I have little to nothing to do with this so I shouldn't probably get involved but everyone has a voice and this is my opinion.

I think apologies from Ichitaka and others would be appreciated but not necessary. I say forget about the apologies. Just stop the distribution of the OP manga with stephen's translations. That's all there is to it from what I can tell.